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Journal of Creation  Volume 26Issue 2 Cover

Journal of Creation 26(2):3–3
August 2012

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Flood By Design
by Mike Oard

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Ancient Ice Ages or Gigantic Submarine Landslides


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Kelp could have produced abundant dropstones during the Flood

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Figure 1. Rocks in tree roots, Black Hills, South Dakota.

Dropstones are defined as rocks with a diameter greater than the thickness of rhythmic beds within which they are deposited. They have been commonly interpreted as rocks that have been dropped from floating ice into lakes or into the ocean. Dropstones in thin-layered sedimentary rocks have been advanced as evidence for ancient ice ages 300 Ma to over 2 Ga ago in the uniformitarian timescale.1 Harland et al. stated: “Numerous large boulders which have penetrated and deformed a series of strata can be used alone for the determination of glaciation.”2 Actually, most investigators simply assume an ancient glaciation if they find only a few rocks in fine-layered sedimentary rocks. But are dropstones really diagnostic of ancient ice ages?

Dropstones caused by many mechanisms

There are lots of problems with the glacial interpretation of dropstones.1,3 These rocks can be deposited by many mechanisms other than floating ice, including bottom-hugging debris flows or turbidity currents, floating kelp, swimming animals, volcanic eruptions, meteorite impacts,4–6 and from floating tree stumps. Uprooted trees commonly contain soil and rock in the root ball (figure 1). The latter presumably explains boulders sometimes found in coal.7

Kelp a significant mechanism for rock transport

There are lots of problems with the glacial interpretation of dropstones.

It has been known for a long time that kelp loosened from the ocean bottom near the shoreline can transport rocks that can fall into fine-grained or rhythmic sediments. But in a recent new study, the process has been quantified for the southeast coast of New Zealand.8 Kelp torn loose and deposited on the beaches was surveyed for 30 weeks, and the weight and nature of attached sediment or rocks was recorded. 8,489 kelp plants were examined and rocks were found to be attached to 27% of kelp holdfasts, the part of the kelp that is anchored to the bottom. The weight per kelp holdfast ranges from 0.1 g to 83 kg with an unusual rock outlier weighing approximately 365 kg! Most kelp holdfasts transported less than 100 g of sediment and rock.

Dropstones from the Flood

During the Flood, all of the mechanisms mentioned above, other than from ice, could have been in operation. The presence of dropstones in fine-grained sediments does not rule out the possibility that they were derived from kelp holdfasts and/or floating tree roots. For instance, countless numbers of floating trees would be expected to end up floating on the floodwater. Rocks entangled within the roots could have been dislodged due to turbulence or the collision of the trees against each other in the Flood log mats. From these quantitative studies of kelp holdfasts, we can now add the transport of rocks of varying sizes by the disruption of kelp beds during the early stages of the Flood, noting that kelp holdfasts have the potential to transport boulders weighing over 100 kg. Such dropstones could have been deposited into fine-grained sediments and their modern interpretation would have nothing to do with ancient glaciations.

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References

  1. Oard, M.J., Ancient Ice Ages or gigantic Submarine Landslides? Creation Research Society Books, Chino Valley, AZ, 1997. Return to text.
  2. Harland, W.B., Herod, K.N. and Krinsley, D.H., The definition and identification of tills and tillites, Earth-Science Reviews 2:225, 1966. Return to text.
  3. Oard, M.J., What is the meaning of dropstones in the rock record? J. Creation 22(3):3–5, 2008. Return to text.
  4. Oberbeck, V.R., Marshall, J.R. and Aggarwal, H., Impacts, tillites, and the breakup of Gondwanaland, J. Geology 101:1–9, 1993. Return to text.
  5. Rampino, M.R., Ancient ‘glacial’ deposits are ejecta of large impacts: the ice age paradox explained, EOS 73(supplement):99, 1992. Return to text.
  6. Oard, M.J., A new challenge to supposed ancient glaciations, J. Creation 9(2):140– 141, 1995. Return to text.
  7. Price, P.H., Erratic boulders in Sewell coal of West Virginia, J. Geology 40:62–73, 1932. Return to text.
  8. Garden, C.J. and Smith, A.M., The role of kelp in sediment transport; observations from southeast New Zealand, Marine Geology 281:35–42, 2011. Return to text.

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Readers’ comments
Seathrun M., Ireland, 20 September 2013

Dear Sir,

you mention soil and boulders trapped in tree roots and say that this explains some boulders found in coal. May I suggest that this could provide an interesting area for further research. For instance, what kind of rock do the boulders consist of? Is it in any way different from the rocks formed since the Deluge? Do we actually know of any pre-Deluge igneous rocks, or did the earth movements associated with the Deluge give rise to the very first volcanoes? If there is soil containing vegetable matter associated with the boulders and/or fossil trees, does the vegetable matter give a different radiometric date to the surrounding boulders or coal? I am sure that many other questions will occur to readers or to your experts who read this e-mail.

God bless your work,

Seathrún Mac Éin

Daniel J., United States, 20 September 2013

"There are lots of problems with the glacial interpretation of dropstones." Can you name some of these problems?

Mike Oard responds

Some of the problems with dropstones being evidence of glaciation is that dropstones can occur by other mechanisms as summarized in chapter 8 in my book “Ancient ice ages or gigantic submarine landslides?” Besides dropstones being dropped from kelp, they can also be dropped from the billions of trees ripped up during the Flood and floating on the Flood water. This would explain the dropstones in coal.

I have several pictures of stones lodged in the roots of trees, one of which is published in the “Journal of Creation.”

Dropstones can also be emplaced by mass flows of various types with stones ending up floating in a finer grained matrix. Dropstones can be emplaced by sea ice melting, although I do not advocate this mechanism for the Flood, since there would have been no sea ice (water too warm). Other possibilities are by swimming animals and meteorite impacts (which I believe there were many during the Flood).

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